cruiscin_lan (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
cruiscin_lan) wrote2010-02-17 11:16 pm
cruiscin_lan) wrote2010-02-17 11:16 pm
Using Polls for Feedback on Fic
EDITED TO ADD: I went back and found the link to the post that made me decide to try this in the first place: I wish that writers left polls at the end of their work by ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
gaudinight.
Before I start rambling, allow me to state that nothing I have to say is at all definitive or even remotely scientific. While I pretty much fail at research methods forever, at least I can offer a few reasons why:
Still, while it might not be useful to examine the results I've gotten so far by using feedback polls, it's certainly interesting, and perhaps someone with a better mind for this sort of thing can take the ball and run with it, so to speak.
I. Reasons to use polls.
One reason to use polls is to find out how many people might actually be reading your fic. LJ Stats can give you an idea of how many people clicked the fic, but unless they leave a comment there's really no way of knowing whether they actually read it or whether they backbuttoned without finishing. By using polls, you can presumably get a number of how many people read a particular story, at the very least.
I'm kind of surprised how the poll numbers compare to comment numbers. The best example is probably this story. Out of fifty-five comments, there are twenty-five unique reviews, but as of right now ninety-nine people have responded to the poll. When I checked that same poll a month after it was posted, there were about seventy poll responses, although you'll just have to take my word for that since I forgot to screencap it or something for posterity.
What this may show is that a) most readers are more comfortable responding to a poll than responding via comment and b) people are especially more comfortable responding to a poll when the fic is no longer "new." This would probably require a better investigation in order to come up with more reliable results.
But this leads to the the second reason I started to use polls - many readers are just more comfortable leaving feedback via polls than they are leaving comments. From what I've read and heard, there are many, many, many reasons for this. And, because I love receiving any and all kinds of feedback, I thought that providing polls might make it easier for readers to respond.
I think it's working.
II. Poll options.
In his long-ass book* Everyone Can Write, Peter Elbow describes four different kinds of audience, and three different kinds of response. The map looks a little like this:
The stars simply mark the intersections on the map (because I am not html-savvy enough to recreate the map exactly as it appears in the book). According to Elbow, ideally a writer should be all over the map in terms of audience and response. But while Elbow is thinking in terms of writing in and for the classroom, I would posit that it fits in pretty well with writing fanfiction too, except I'd probably arrange the "audience" column in reverse. While this might not be entirely accurate, I believe most fanfic authors write with themselves as the primary audience. Then comes the audience of allies - friendly betas, flist members - and the audience of peers. I'm not quite sure how the audience with authority fits into this model, because fanfiction is written for primarily entertainment and enjoyment, and not evaluation.
At any rate, more relevant here than the types of audience are the types of responses that we receive on our stories. At the archives and sites I'm familiar with, response is received through comments, hit counts, or private emails, and the community aspect of many social networking sites makes it hard to categorize some types of feedback. For the most part, I would equate concrit with "evaluative feedback," and lump most other responses ("I loved this!/Good job!/Thanks for sharing!") into "nonevaluative feedback."
I think anyone who's posted anything on the internet knows what "sharing, no response" feels like sometimes.
Moving on - I think of these feedback polls as occupying some strange space between the "nonevaluative feedback" and "no response" columns. It requires very little effort on the part of the reader; one of the options I consistently include is "read it" which provides a way of keeping more detailed stats, simply testing out to see who didn't back button right away. The other consistent option I use is "liked it," which is closer to the "nonevaluative feedback" column.
Another option I used to include "review in the comments," which I've started to phase out because personally I think it's redundant most of the time.
A recent addition to the poll has been the option "didn't like it." I added that option first to a fic that dealt with mature themes, because I can understand being intrigued by the story but not liking the execution, or vice versa. Since I started including the "didn't like it option," it's been marked at least twice.
The only problem with "didn't like it"? I don't know why. What exactly didn't they like about the stories? Since it's a response to a poll, there's no dialogue between reader and author as to what issues in the fic might need to be addressed. But while I'm boggled by this response, as a reader I might appreciate the option to be honest without facing the possibility of confrontation via commenting or email.
I also include silly options in polls. The response they get is varied.
All feedback polls I make are check box polls, because a) it allows readers to choose more than one option, in case one doesn't adequately express their response and b) I can make stupid ticky box jokes.
III. Personal observations
Initially I had reservations about using polls, and sometimes I still do. A part of me fears that using them might come across as self-important, or as treating readers as little more than numbers, I'm not sure. Still, I've never gotten a negative response to the polls themselves (just the stories they accompany). In fact, several people have told me that they think they're a good idea, or interesting at least, and now if I forget to post a poll, at least one or two commenters will be quick to point it out.
IV. Questions?
I know I've got 'em.
For authors: Would you try using polls to help encourage reader response? Why or why not?
For readers: Would you use polls after reading? Why or why not?
What improvements would you suggest for those who might want to use polls?
What was the most awesome dinosaur ever, as rated by science?
Is receiving feedback via poll as satisfactory as receiving feedback in other ways? Why or why not?
And, hot damn, I'm too used to doing these now.
[Poll #1526944]
*Okay, it's not really that long. It's not quite 500 pages and actually if you're interested in writing pedagogy, it's an engaging read. It's just that I barely have enough attention span to finish a sen
gaudinight.Before I start rambling, allow me to state that nothing I have to say is at all definitive or even remotely scientific. While I pretty much fail at research methods forever, at least I can offer a few reasons why:
- I do not always remember to include polls.
- My polling options are not always consistent.
- My polling options are quite often silly (i.e. remember that time
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
metafandom told me I was good-looking?).
Still, while it might not be useful to examine the results I've gotten so far by using feedback polls, it's certainly interesting, and perhaps someone with a better mind for this sort of thing can take the ball and run with it, so to speak.
I. Reasons to use polls.
One reason to use polls is to find out how many people might actually be reading your fic. LJ Stats can give you an idea of how many people clicked the fic, but unless they leave a comment there's really no way of knowing whether they actually read it or whether they backbuttoned without finishing. By using polls, you can presumably get a number of how many people read a particular story, at the very least.
I'm kind of surprised how the poll numbers compare to comment numbers. The best example is probably this story. Out of fifty-five comments, there are twenty-five unique reviews, but as of right now ninety-nine people have responded to the poll. When I checked that same poll a month after it was posted, there were about seventy poll responses, although you'll just have to take my word for that since I forgot to screencap it or something for posterity.
What this may show is that a) most readers are more comfortable responding to a poll than responding via comment and b) people are especially more comfortable responding to a poll when the fic is no longer "new." This would probably require a better investigation in order to come up with more reliable results.
But this leads to the the second reason I started to use polls - many readers are just more comfortable leaving feedback via polls than they are leaving comments. From what I've read and heard, there are many, many, many reasons for this. And, because I love receiving any and all kinds of feedback, I thought that providing polls might make it easier for readers to respond.
I think it's working.
II. Poll options.
In his long-ass book* Everyone Can Write, Peter Elbow describes four different kinds of audience, and three different kinds of response. The map looks a little like this:
| Sharing, but no response | Response, but no criticism or evaluation | Criticism or evaluation | |
| Audience with authority, eg., teachers, editors, supervisors, employers | |||
| Audience of peers | |||
| Audience of allies - readers who particularly care for the writer | |||
| Audience of self alone - private writing |
The stars simply mark the intersections on the map (because I am not html-savvy enough to recreate the map exactly as it appears in the book). According to Elbow, ideally a writer should be all over the map in terms of audience and response. But while Elbow is thinking in terms of writing in and for the classroom, I would posit that it fits in pretty well with writing fanfiction too, except I'd probably arrange the "audience" column in reverse. While this might not be entirely accurate, I believe most fanfic authors write with themselves as the primary audience. Then comes the audience of allies - friendly betas, flist members - and the audience of peers. I'm not quite sure how the audience with authority fits into this model, because fanfiction is written for primarily entertainment and enjoyment, and not evaluation.
At any rate, more relevant here than the types of audience are the types of responses that we receive on our stories. At the archives and sites I'm familiar with, response is received through comments, hit counts, or private emails, and the community aspect of many social networking sites makes it hard to categorize some types of feedback. For the most part, I would equate concrit with "evaluative feedback," and lump most other responses ("I loved this!/Good job!/Thanks for sharing!") into "nonevaluative feedback."
I think anyone who's posted anything on the internet knows what "sharing, no response" feels like sometimes.
Moving on - I think of these feedback polls as occupying some strange space between the "nonevaluative feedback" and "no response" columns. It requires very little effort on the part of the reader; one of the options I consistently include is "read it" which provides a way of keeping more detailed stats, simply testing out to see who didn't back button right away. The other consistent option I use is "liked it," which is closer to the "nonevaluative feedback" column.
Another option I used to include "review in the comments," which I've started to phase out because personally I think it's redundant most of the time.
A recent addition to the poll has been the option "didn't like it." I added that option first to a fic that dealt with mature themes, because I can understand being intrigued by the story but not liking the execution, or vice versa. Since I started including the "didn't like it option," it's been marked at least twice.
The only problem with "didn't like it"? I don't know why. What exactly didn't they like about the stories? Since it's a response to a poll, there's no dialogue between reader and author as to what issues in the fic might need to be addressed. But while I'm boggled by this response, as a reader I might appreciate the option to be honest without facing the possibility of confrontation via commenting or email.
I also include silly options in polls. The response they get is varied.
All feedback polls I make are check box polls, because a) it allows readers to choose more than one option, in case one doesn't adequately express their response and b) I can make stupid ticky box jokes.
III. Personal observations
Initially I had reservations about using polls, and sometimes I still do. A part of me fears that using them might come across as self-important, or as treating readers as little more than numbers, I'm not sure. Still, I've never gotten a negative response to the polls themselves (just the stories they accompany). In fact, several people have told me that they think they're a good idea, or interesting at least, and now if I forget to post a poll, at least one or two commenters will be quick to point it out.
IV. Questions?
I know I've got 'em.
And, hot damn, I'm too used to doing these now.
[Poll #1526944]
*Okay, it's not really that long. It's not quite 500 pages and actually if you're interested in writing pedagogy, it's an engaging read. It's just that I barely have enough attention span to finish a sen
no subject
Okay, apparently I actually have two questions. Do you always set up your polls with the answers viewable to all? I think that could influence how many people answer/answer honestly. I remember once there was a poll on some comm about whether we should have some community event (awards or a comment fic meme or something) and I remember feeling terrible being a) one of only a handful of people who said it was a bad idea and b) that everyone would know I was one of the killjoy stick in the muds. It's one thing for the author to know I ticked didn't like it, but I'm not sure I'd want that broadcast to the whole world, it makes me look like a bitch, y'know?
Oh! I thought of another question... when there's a discrepancy between the number of "read it's" and "liked it's" do you assume those are people who didn't like but for whatever reason didn't tick "I didn't like it?" Does everyone who ticked liked it also tick read it? When I answer, I'm never sure if I'm meant to tick both or if it by ticking "liked it" you know I mean I read it too. Have you tried with options like "Read it", "Read it and liked it" and "Read it and didn't like it", to seperate out those who read the fic and had no opinion on it?
no subject
Um. Probably not? I'm kind of uncomfortable asking for reviews like that even if I have no problem with other people using them.
# For readers: Would you use polls after reading? Why or why not?
I tend to comment on most stuff I read and like anyway. I don't think I'd fill it out for a fic I didn't like any more than I would leave a comment for it. There's always the chance the author could PM me to ask why I ticked didn't like it which would mean I would be dragged into a discussion I was trying to avoid.
# What improvements would you suggest for those who might want to use polls?
Only the read it/read it & liked it/read & didn't like it options above for stupid people like me.
# What was the most awesome dinosaur ever, as rated by science?
STEGOSAURUS. TRUFAX.
# Is receiving feedback via poll as satisfactory as receiving feedback in other ways? Why or why not?
I've never done a poll on a fic but I think the answer for me would be no? I've done a bunch of polls on random crap and while it's nice to have a whole bunch of people weighing in on the sexalicious nature of Zachary Quinto's ass, the comments prompted by the polls are always way more fun. I like have conversations with people. And getting a compliment without being able to say thank you makes me a bit uncomfortable receiving it.
no subject
And now I'm shutting up, I swear.
no subject
Not gonna lie, it was awesome going back to that first fic and seeing how the numbers have jumped up, so you're definitely not the only one. I know I only posted it like three months ago, but I wonder if more people will respond to the poll in six months' or a year's time.
no subject
Can you elaborate why? Because even now when I'm used to putting polls on fics, I'm hesitant to include them because I don't want to come across as begging for reviews or something.
There's always the chance the author could PM me to ask why I ticked didn't like it which would mean I would be dragged into a discussion I was trying to avoid.
I would probably not click the "didn't like it" option for this reason. This is why its inclusion on the poll is problematic for me...
I like have conversations with people. And getting a compliment without being able to say thank you makes me a bit uncomfortable receiving it.
This is so true. As much as I like seeing feedback in any way, I love being able to have discussions with people in the comments.
no subject
Sometimes, even though I'm not British, I can be very British about things. Putting a poll would make me feel very self-important. It's one thing to put a fic out there and hope people read & review, it's another to go out of my way to set up a poll that presumes anyone wants to comment.
I think I'm biased here also because you're on my flist and I know you and because of that I don't think there's anything particularly self-aggrandising about your motives. But if it was someone I didn't know from Adam who started feedback polls? I think I'd probably be less charitable about it and might even deliberately not answer the poll even if I had both read and liked the fic just on the basis that if I wanted to comment I would do it of my own violation not because the power of TICKY compelled me.
But also, you know, clearly I have issues. ;)
no subject
You've also hit the nail on the head in terms of every insecurity I've ever had about using polls.
If it helps, I went back and found the exact post I had read that kind of pushed me into trying this in the first place:
I wish writers left polls at the end of their work
no subject
On the other hand when I'm feeling lazy or read a fic but wasn't enamoured, I'd happily tick "read it"...I am a contradiction in terms!
no subject
Yes. I don't think it ever occurred to me not to. As I said to
Does everyone who ticked liked it also tick read it?
No, and this is something that gets pointed out by readers from time to time. I think people just click "liked it" or the goofy option without thinking to click "read it" most of the time, because their having read the fic would be implied. I think perhaps I'll start rephrasing the options on your suggestion and we'll see how it turns out!
no subject
But if you're hoping for more honest feedback, I don't think a poll makes it inherently easier to give that if everyone can still see what your opinion was. idk, maybe it's because I always check out who said what too when it comes to polls that I'm more paranoid about everyone knowing that I didn't like a fic that the rest of fandom is squeeing over because it looks like I'm just harshing everyone else's good time.
no subject
I don't think you can make completely anonymous polls.
I don't know if that changes your response at all. I need more coffee.
no subject
I was thinking something along the lines of: if only the author can see that I, perdiccas, didn't like the fic and everyone else can only see that of 50 people 49 liked it, then I'd feel less like a general douchebag about being the odd man out? It still lets other readers know there was less than 100% approval for the fic (helpful for those who use reviews to judge if they wanna read a fic), but it's still semi-private correspondence with the author because there's no: the whole world now knows perdiccas didn't like cruiscin_lan's fic and what's she gonna do about it?
Except then you still run into the problem that the author might pm me about it. And that I'd feel more than a little ass-y just announcing I didn't like a fic without further explanation. And of course, there's nothing stopping the author telling everyone they know that I'm an ass who answers polls just to say I hate their fic whether the poll results are private or not. The more I think about it, the less certain I am that it would make a difference who can see the results.
One more potential consideration: I think if I wrote something especially kinky or explicit w/a feedback poll attached, I'd make the results private because not everyone is comfortable announcing to the world they read and enjoy scat, you know?